The Manufactured Housing Forums

Hello!

This is my first post to these forums. I've been doing a lot of research the past few months into manufactured and modular housing. My fiance and I have been to many of the local dealerships here in the Wilmington, NC area. So far the best fit in terms of floorplan and affordability has been Fleetwood, but being a first time home-buyer I'm VERY nervous about committing myself to anything yet.

The future value of my home is very important to me, as is the quality of construction and the level of maintenance (i.e., I don't want to fix a bunch of things that shouldn't need to be fixed!). We've also pushed our initial budget a little higher than expected because we want to buy the BEST that we can with our money--we're likely going to live in our first house for at least 5 years. I don't want to outgrow our home in a matter of a year or two.

With all that said, this is what we're looking at purchasing:

2280sq ft Fleetwood Entertainer
Modular and off-frame upgrade
Sheetrock/drywall upgrade (all areas except "wet areas")
OSB flooring upgrade

I had the opportunity to walk through this exact version of the Fleetwood model (same major upgrades), at a company dealership location. It was beautiful! But I know sometimes that that beauty can only be skin deep..

I guess my concern is still: Can we be reasonably assured that our home will be strong, sturdy, and stand the test of time? Are we making the right choices to protect our investment and prevent depreciation of value?

Thank you so much for any help or advice. I'm driving our dealers crazy with questions, and every day I have more questions. lol Buying a house is new territory for me and I want to try avoiding any mistakes that I will regret!

Nikki
Wilmington, NC

Hi Nikki,

By the sound of your post you are serious about your home! The Entertainer is a beautiful home. You made a wise choice by upgrading to OSB flooring...you won't be sorry. A couple concerns you might need to thing about:

1) Price....I don't know what they are charging you but I've priced a couple myself and a modular version is pretty steep. If you're looking at a home budget of $80,000 you must remember that the location & lot size is everything if you're looking at future resale. If you're not careful you can have $115,000 invested after your lot purchase and the needed set your home up (foundation, water, sewer or septic, driveway, etc.).

2) Depreciation - If your home is doublewide or modular it will depreciate regardless. I hate to say this but it's just the truth! A mobile home manufactuer can't make it the same quality as a stick build house without passing the extra cost to the customer. This is why you had to pay more for the OSB flooring. And you'll have to pay more for a modular version PLUS a solid block/brick foundation is needed which is more expensive. This is why your lot location and lot size will always be the strength of your re-sale price.

I am planning to buy a 28x80 Clayton-Norris home (customized) for $70,000 and my lot is $25,000, but my lot appraises for $38,000. So, this will help in the overall value of the property. BUT, I don't ever plan to sell it. I want to pay for it and leave it for my family. I think this is probably one of the biggest disappointments in manufactured home ownership is re-sale. If I were going to buy a big home like "The Entertainer", I would want to make it my home for life! Unless manufactured housing appreciates like a stick-build house, it's usually wise to stay or at least break even.

Best of luck! You're going to love that home

C. Yeary - Kentucky

First your dealer should welcome your questions...just be sure he/she can back up their answers with references or in writing...Ask the dealer for customer referals..especially for referrals concerning off frame modular homes...

Unfortunately when you get a modular home you lose all your protections of the HUD code system...There will be no government agency to help protect you with this home..if it is a disaster..your only hope will be in the courts and arbitration system.....
Many dealers are jumping on the modular band wagon...many do not have the experience to protect you..set up is FAR more important with modular homes...Small irregularities in the foundation can void the whole Fleetwood warranty..This makes the dealer much more important than with a manufactured home..

Be sure this dealer has experience in off frame modular homes...check his previous customers well...

A few direct observation...1)...No good modular home would require an upgrade to OSB floors...the fact that the modular is standard with press board floors would make me very suspect of the whole home...

2)...This is a huge home.(average stick built home in the US under 300K is about 1800 feet of living area)..you should be very careful about energy options...Be sure it is an Energy Star certified home...Fleetwood does offer this option..If you have the home actually fully certified (which will require an inspection by an EPA designated inspector after the home is built on your lot)..You will know that then you have the best...plus you will have the actual certificate to show future buyers and help in resale..You can go here for all Energy Star builders in NC...I see that Fleetwood has built 4 homes in NC as Energy Star ready in the last 12 months..Go here to see the info..

http://www.energystar.gov/index.cfm?fus ... &s_code=NC

Notice 1 manufacturer built 470 Energy Star homes in NC in the last 12 months..

3)...5 years is a short time in housing talk...if you buy this home with no cash (or very little cash)..you will be financing far over 100% of the purchase price...after five years you will have paid off only a very small part of your original loan and still owe amount well over the original purchase price...plus sales costs..real estate fees..adveretising and the such...it will be hard to make a lot of money on this sale...The point of this discussion is that if sell in 5 years...the home and land will have to appreciate about 4% per year just to break even..Folks who buy site built with low downs have the same problem in such a short term....

4)...Appreciation is a function of location much more than what type of home is on the lot...For a good study of this question and recommendations about good locations..see the Consumer Unions study of this question..You can find it here..It is about 50 pages long and comes to some interesting conclusions..

"Our data shows that the average appreciation rate of manufactured homes on owner owned land is not consistently
statistically different than the appreciation rate of site built homes."

The discussion goes on and points out that some manufactured home lose because of location..there are specific recommendations about location in the study..
You can find it here..

http://www.consumersunion.org/pdf/mh/Appreciation.pdf

4).....Understand that high appraisal on the land is a bit decieving..Appraisals do not set value...the market sets value..If this land was actually worth that much it would be selling for that much..The only good point about this high appraisal is that is better than one the other way around..

You might consider buying one of the books here in the book store...

Good Luck

Thank you for the responses, Yeary2 and Murray!

I am really serious about the decision I'll make, whatever it is.. it's a scary step to take and I don't want to jump out of the frying pan and right into the fire.

The risk of depreciation is definitely one of the largest concerns for me. My fiance and I are planning to talk with a few realtors about land in the area (we're new here) because I know that the house will almost certainly depreciate in value. Because of that, and because this area is growing very rapidly, I want to get a nice piece of land that I'm resonably confident will go up in value and can be subdivided and sold in the future.

If we decided on a Fleetwood modular it would be a long term home. I'm in a unique sort of situation in that I hobby breed small parrots. I would love to expand and build some outdoor aviaries, which are usually pretty permanent or don't knock down easily. Moving is very stressful on the birds, so I would rather pick a long term home that is large enough to accommodate everyone, including possibly planning for children in the future.

At this point, I'm very wary about committing to this house. I think the next step for us will involve a factory tour since so much can hinge on the individual factory, as well as getting some references from our dealer. I would also like to talk to some contractors, or even inspectors that can give me an unbiased opinion of this specific factory's work. I'm generally not a very hard-nosed person, but I think this is something that I need to be a little pushier and firmer about than normal.

Murray, my dealer does welcome my questions, but sometimes I get the feeling that they're not used to them being asked. It's not that they don't want to answer the questions.. just kind of like they haven't had anyone bother to ask them before. And the gentleman from Fleetwood, that I did a conference call with, had just started working with them so he was double-checking everything with (I'm guessing) his supervisor.

Thank you for the information about Energy Star, too. (Sadly, the company that has so many compliant homes is the one company that make me incredibly uncomfortable with their sales pitches.) On the Fleetwood invoice quote I have these Energy Star upgrades are listed, but there is no explanation about what each one entails:

Energy Star-Climate ZN 2 $2,495
Energy Star-Climate ZN 3 $975
Energy Star-Climate ZN 4 $495

The modular code upgrade includes 6:12 roof pitch, architectural shingles, and R30-13-19 insulation. Their website claims that floors are framed with 2x8s, but I believe the modular upgrade includes 2x10s.

I want to take a huge list of questions with me on the factory tour (that's assuming they give them), so I hope they're ready. Ha ha. Some of my big concerns right now are the type of studs in the exterior and interior walls (2x6, 2x4, etc), warranty coverage, rechecking whether or not OSB floors are actually part of the modular package or not, and what the Energy Star packages offer. I think a wise decision would be to get everything they say will be included in writing, too, in case a complaint ever did have to be filed.

If we DID opt for the Energy Star package (not sure what our zone is), what all will that inspector check before the house passes inspection? I would rest a little easier if that included the wall studs and such, since so many things are out of sight once the sheetrock goes up. And don't modulars have to meet local stick-built codes? Would Fleetwood decide who did that inspection?

Phew, sorry for such a long-winded post. Trying to be thorough. I do think I'll be picking up a book, and I will check out that report on housing locations. If anyone has any suggestions on specific things to look for/ask about I would love to add them to my list.

Nikki

You asked..."If we DID opt for the Energy Star package (not sure what our zone is), what all will that inspector check before the house passes inspection? I would rest a little easier if that included the wall studs and such, since so many things are out of sight once the sheetrock goes up. And don't modulars have to meet local stick-built codes? Would Fleetwood decide who did that inspection?"

First the home is inspected for energy star compliance while in the plant by a trained and certified inspector..often one that works for the manufacturer..

Then for full certification..there will be a field inspection by a certified Energy Star inspector...he will be inspecting the locally supplied a/c to be sure it meets the energy star rules...about 20% more efficient than standard airs..and he will check to see if the required programmable thermostat is properly installed...He will make a quick inspection of the set to be sure the seals between the sections are properly installed...The a/c and thermostat are usually more expensive than the standard...and could add to the cost a little...The inpspector is usually coordinated by the dealer..or you can call one your self..they are listed on the web site..Once inspected they will authorize an official certification by the EPA which will be a certificate you can keep and use in the future during resale..

Fleetwood warranties are 1 year...on mods..the home must be properly set or they can get out of it all together..

You might try that other manufacturer again...you must have found someone new...ask for the GM..

To find out what Climate Zone you are in, try this link:
http://www.smarterwayinc.com/

To find out what Climate Zone you are in, try this link:
http://www.smarterwayinc.com/